Well, I see it differently -- are these massive government programs working or not, without getting into whether it's Bush or Obama, Republican or Democrat. If I asked them as separate questions, then you're getting into partisanship and personality.
Well then Gabor & Bea, please comment on each...I personally feel that neither program has done anything to stimulate the economy. If you or I kept spending money we didn't have without any means to pay back the dept we would be jailed.
I agree that they should be two different questions...I think the bank bail outs have helped more , then the so called stimulus has.The stimulus was to create jobs,which it didn't,and the Bank bail outs were to save the banks which it did.....So how should i answer the question.
It wasn't meant as attempt to politize it, one party against the other - or one president against the other.
They are two separate issues.
Both, in my opinion, are still in the process. We've had more time to look at the good and bad of the bank bailout.
The stimulus program, under President Bush, didn't have the desired effect since most people used the money to spend down private debt rather than use it to stimulate the economy.
Most likely, under President Obama, the same thing is happening.
So, I guess the answer for me will be unsure.
The last thing we need is for the government to get their nose into every aspect of our lives. This country was founded with "smaller government" in mind. The government has social programmed everything as of late and in the long run it's going to doom us. That's just my opinion, of course. People should take care of themselves, help other people without being asked or told to do so and business should be allowed to prove itself without creating false arenas like the Federal government is doing now. This economic bailout really is the ultimate ponzi scheme.
I'd love to be able to move to my cabin in the woods, grow a garden and live off the land but I'm afraid Obama will come and arrest me when I can't afford to buy into his proposed social health care program.
WASHINGTON -- Americans who refuse to buy affordable medical coverage could be hit with fines of more than $1,000 under a health care overhaul bill unveiled Thursday by key Senate Democrats looking to fulfill President Barack Obama's top domestic priority.
Yeah, Barack Hussein Obama is who I want in charge of this country. Okay..not really...
Stimulus Money?? Bailout money?? Did I miss something, cause I havent seen any of it, used for anything worthwhile, besides the rich stuffing their pockets with it, crying broke, filing bankruptcy, giving themselves bonuses, raises, ect.
Mark, how do you know it worked? Because no banks went out of business? That assumes two things that are unknown -- that they would have failed without the money, and that their going out of business would have been a bad thing. We have no idea where all this money went, what good it did, how it was used -- nothing. It went into a big black hole.
It's important to remember that TARP was passed in a rush with no public hearings, no studies, no data, no proof that it was needed -- just the say-so of a bunch of Wall Street and Washington insiders. There is essentially no Congressional oversight or any kind of accountability.
So how is it even possible to conclude that it worked?
The poll's just another way of phrasing, how do you feel about the economy post massive government spending to fix the economy.
To balance it I made it Bush's bailout for purposes of the poll, but in reality TARP can be equally blamed on Bush and Pelosi. And "blame" is the right word there.
Karen, that's exactly what happened where I work. Our wages were frozen for 3 years, our cost of living pay was tossed into the garbage (6%) and we were told absolutely no overtime is to be worked. I'll lose about $45K or more over those three years and the cost of living pay was what was funding my pension.
It was revealed that the top executives of the company all got bonuses, yet again. The top 2 corporate executives got multi-million dollar bonuses. One of the two even got a 26% raise on top of the bonus money. Corporate greed is still happening no matter what plans or rules uncle Barry makes. I'm glad to have my job but at the same time my leaders aren't leading by example.
The grim reality, stings me to the core. The middle class will forever be under the thumb of the Corporate Leaders, who will continue to manipulate our freedoms, for as long as "We the People" let them.
I always had a good feeling about Obama, because he offered "Change". No more of the same old story, forced down our throats for decades.
I still have Hope that the Prez will succeed, in changing the world, and helping all of us to make the best of what, Our God, has givin us. Its a hard fight though, and far be it, from us to judge him, unless in his position. As for healthcare, and all that inplies, Good Luck Barrock!
I'll just pray for peace, and for our leader, President Obama, to handle, and concure the Dishonest, Selfish, Moneygrubbers, on Wallstreet, and in Corporate America. Also to promote Peace in other countries, while still having a close eye on the corruption.
WASHINGTON -- Americans who refuse to buy affordable medical coverage could be hit with fines of more than $1,000 under a health care overhaul bill unveiled Thursday by key Senate Democrats looking to fulfill President Barack Obama's top domestic priority.
This source tells it all. Fair and Balanced coverage is a myth.
I'm having a hard time going to the link. Just my silly computer.. Bea if that is the case, its sad. Now they can force you to have insurance, and fine you if you dont? What are they planning to do with you when you cant come up with the fine?? It'll be a cold day in Hell, Its criminal..
Howard ..On that banking issue the money was loaned to the banks to be paid pay back when they could go out and issue more stock or bring in more income to the bank ,So that they could start paying the TARP money back,which is happening now.The banks are raising capital in the open market to do this..When people were starting to stop paying on mortgages that they agreed to pay the bank, they were stuck with alot of assets that couldn't be valued..So there Debt to Equity ratio showed many banks insolvent ..The government issued TARP money to get them over this..And so far it has been working..Goldman Sacs for one has paid it all back..with interest.......So yes it is working..,,
The stimulus has not created any jobs so that in not working......Two different questions.
As a Conservative, I think the TARP will go down as one of worst fiscal policies of the Bush Administration. I have never been a fan of corporate welfare wether in the form of tax breaks, bailouts, subsidies or whatever. They undermine the abilities of free markets to work the way they were intended. We just got through giving GM millions of dollars in Govt. money, just to see them go bankrupt. Why couldn't they have gone bankrupt without our handouts. When left alone companies can turn things around if they really are serious about fiscal responsibility. Ford is a great example of this as they just announce a profitable quarter without taking any Govt. money.
Posted by Karen Miconi on July 27, 2009 - 4:04pm
I'm having a hard time going to the link. Just my silly computer.. Bea if that is the case, its sad. Now they can force you to have insurance, and fine you if you dont? What are they planning to do with you when you cant come up with the fine?? It'll be a cold day in Hell, Its criminal..
Karen,
Fox News is strictly in the pockets of those who want to see President Obama destroyed. It is hardly a source that is giving fair and balanced coverage.
Bea,
Say what you want about Fox News, but its news is the most balanced as rated by idependent polls. One after the other after the other. Its news commentary shows are right wing. There is a big difference between the two.
Obama's stimulus was supposed to stop us at 8% unemployment. We are on the way to 10%. It failed.
Bush's "bailout" (though I opposed them) of the banks worked for to loosen the credit markets for some banks that weren't hammered by Blubbering Barney's Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac fiasco.
Well I believe YES, they have worked for the rich to get richer and NO, for the people, they were intended to work for. So, it depends on which side of the fence you are on.
BEA, FOX news is right wing and CNN is left wing. So, instead of getting our political answer from them. Do some fact finding. I can't truly say that FOX is out to destroy Obama because, he has been doing that himself.
If Fox news is about destroying Obama,Then what was MSNBC about destroying Bush...MSNBC is the most one side News network i've seen..That's all they do is trash the GOP..What happened to all the outrage directed at Bush about bringing the troops home..Obama has added more troops in Afganistan..Whats the differance..Were's all the outrage..i though we were going to bring all the troops home..When is the date we are leaving Afganistan...All they did was hammer Bush for a date to pull out of Iraq...I though we were closing Gitmo...Still no plan..just like his Stimulus plan..All BS...Like Peter said,Obama said if we did this Stimulus plan right away,don't read it just vote on it ,it would keep unemployment at 8%,talk about being had..At least with the Banks we see results..
The News doesn't always tell the truth does it?I know Obama would like to do things like close Guantanamo.End the war.But he can not they will not let him will they?
Who is this "they" that won't let him? It's really easy to make promises to just about anything, until you actually have to be held accountable for them.
Where is the President supposed to send all these detainees currently being held? They are very bad people, most were taken on the field of battle, and no country wants them, including the countries they originate from. Also, many of the ones that were supposedly innocent and let go earlier went back to their hostile actions and have been re-captured. What should we do with them?
That is two seperate
That is two seperate questions Howard.
Posted by Gabor Deutsch on
Posted by Gabor Deutsch on July 27, 2009 - 12:24pm
That is two seperate questions Howard.
I agree...difficult to answer both with one poll.
Well, I see it differently --
Well, I see it differently -- are these massive government programs working or not, without getting into whether it's Bush or Obama, Republican or Democrat. If I asked them as separate questions, then you're getting into partisanship and personality.
Well then Gabor & Bea, please
Well then Gabor & Bea, please comment on each...I personally feel that neither program has done anything to stimulate the economy. If you or I kept spending money we didn't have without any means to pay back the dept we would be jailed.
I agree that they should be
I agree that they should be two different questions...I think the bank bail outs have helped more , then the so called stimulus has.The stimulus was to create jobs,which it didn't,and the Bank bail outs were to save the banks which it did.....So how should i answer the question.
It wasn't meant as attempt to
It wasn't meant as attempt to politize it, one party against the other - or one president against the other.
They are two separate issues.
Both, in my opinion, are still in the process. We've had more time to look at the good and bad of the bank bailout.
The stimulus program, under President Bush, didn't have the desired effect since most people used the money to spend down private debt rather than use it to stimulate the economy.
Most likely, under President Obama, the same thing is happening.
So, I guess the answer for me will be unsure.
The last thing we need is for
The last thing we need is for the government to get their nose into every aspect of our lives. This country was founded with "smaller government" in mind. The government has social programmed everything as of late and in the long run it's going to doom us. That's just my opinion, of course. People should take care of themselves, help other people without being asked or told to do so and business should be allowed to prove itself without creating false arenas like the Federal government is doing now. This economic bailout really is the ultimate ponzi scheme.
I'd love to be able to move
I'd love to be able to move to my cabin in the woods, grow a garden and live off the land but I'm afraid Obama will come and arrest me when I can't afford to buy into his proposed social health care program.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/07/02/senate-democrats-trim-cost-h…
WASHINGTON -- Americans who refuse to buy affordable medical coverage could be hit with fines of more than $1,000 under a health care overhaul bill unveiled Thursday by key Senate Democrats looking to fulfill President Barack Obama's top domestic priority.
Yeah, Barack Hussein Obama is who I want in charge of this country. Okay..not really...
Stimulus Money?? Bailout
Stimulus Money?? Bailout money?? Did I miss something, cause I havent seen any of it, used for anything worthwhile, besides the rich stuffing their pockets with it, crying broke, filing bankruptcy, giving themselves bonuses, raises, ect.
Mark, how do you know it
Mark, how do you know it worked? Because no banks went out of business? That assumes two things that are unknown -- that they would have failed without the money, and that their going out of business would have been a bad thing. We have no idea where all this money went, what good it did, how it was used -- nothing. It went into a big black hole.
It's important to remember that TARP was passed in a rush with no public hearings, no studies, no data, no proof that it was needed -- just the say-so of a bunch of Wall Street and Washington insiders. There is essentially no Congressional oversight or any kind of accountability.
So how is it even possible to conclude that it worked?
The poll's just another way of phrasing, how do you feel about the economy post massive government spending to fix the economy.
To balance it I made it Bush's bailout for purposes of the poll, but in reality TARP can be equally blamed on Bush and Pelosi. And "blame" is the right word there.
Karen, that's exactly what
Karen, that's exactly what happened where I work. Our wages were frozen for 3 years, our cost of living pay was tossed into the garbage (6%) and we were told absolutely no overtime is to be worked. I'll lose about $45K or more over those three years and the cost of living pay was what was funding my pension.
It was revealed that the top executives of the company all got bonuses, yet again. The top 2 corporate executives got multi-million dollar bonuses. One of the two even got a 26% raise on top of the bonus money. Corporate greed is still happening no matter what plans or rules uncle Barry makes. I'm glad to have my job but at the same time my leaders aren't leading by example.
The grim reality, stings me
The grim reality, stings me to the core. The middle class will forever be under the thumb of the Corporate Leaders, who will continue to manipulate our freedoms, for as long as "We the People" let them.
I always had a good feeling about Obama, because he offered "Change". No more of the same old story, forced down our throats for decades.
I still have Hope that the Prez will succeed, in changing the world, and helping all of us to make the best of what, Our God, has givin us. Its a hard fight though, and far be it, from us to judge him, unless in his position. As for healthcare, and all that inplies, Good Luck Barrock!
I'll just pray for peace, and for our leader, President Obama, to handle, and concure the Dishonest, Selfish, Moneygrubbers, on Wallstreet, and in Corporate America. Also to promote Peace in other countries, while still having a close eye on the corruption.
http://www.foxnews.com/politi
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/07/02/senate-democrats-trim-cost-he...
WASHINGTON -- Americans who refuse to buy affordable medical coverage could be hit with fines of more than $1,000 under a health care overhaul bill unveiled Thursday by key Senate Democrats looking to fulfill President Barack Obama's top domestic priority.
This source tells it all. Fair and Balanced coverage is a myth.
I'm having a hard time going
I'm having a hard time going to the link. Just my silly computer.. Bea if that is the case, its sad. Now they can force you to have insurance, and fine you if you dont? What are they planning to do with you when you cant come up with the fine?? It'll be a cold day in Hell, Its criminal..
Howard ..On that banking
Howard ..On that banking issue the money was loaned to the banks to be paid pay back when they could go out and issue more stock or bring in more income to the bank ,So that they could start paying the TARP money back,which is happening now.The banks are raising capital in the open market to do this..When people were starting to stop paying on mortgages that they agreed to pay the bank, they were stuck with alot of assets that couldn't be valued..So there Debt to Equity ratio showed many banks insolvent ..The government issued TARP money to get them over this..And so far it has been working..Goldman Sacs for one has paid it all back..with interest.......So yes it is working..,,
The stimulus has not created any jobs so that in not working......Two different questions.
As a Conservative, I think
As a Conservative, I think the TARP will go down as one of worst fiscal policies of the Bush Administration. I have never been a fan of corporate welfare wether in the form of tax breaks, bailouts, subsidies or whatever. They undermine the abilities of free markets to work the way they were intended. We just got through giving GM millions of dollars in Govt. money, just to see them go bankrupt. Why couldn't they have gone bankrupt without our handouts. When left alone companies can turn things around if they really are serious about fiscal responsibility. Ford is a great example of this as they just announce a profitable quarter without taking any Govt. money.
Posted by Karen Miconi on
Posted by Karen Miconi on July 27, 2009 - 4:04pm
I'm having a hard time going to the link. Just my silly computer.. Bea if that is the case, its sad. Now they can force you to have insurance, and fine you if you dont? What are they planning to do with you when you cant come up with the fine?? It'll be a cold day in Hell, Its criminal..
Karen,
Fox News is strictly in the pockets of those who want to see President Obama destroyed. It is hardly a source that is giving fair and balanced coverage.
Read this article, which was posted in a site that certainly isn't pro-Obama, but not dedicated to destroying him.
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0609/24185.html
Bea, Say what you want about
Bea,
Say what you want about Fox News, but its news is the most balanced as rated by idependent polls. One after the other after the other. Its news commentary shows are right wing. There is a big difference between the two.
http://www.yelp.com/topic/new-york-foxnews-is-the-most-balanced-electio…
Obama's stimulus was supposed to stop us at 8% unemployment. We are on the way to 10%. It failed.
Bush's "bailout" (though I opposed them) of the banks worked for to loosen the credit markets for some banks that weren't hammered by Blubbering Barney's Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac fiasco.
http://blog.timesunion.com/business/first-niagara-receives-federal-bail…
http://blog.timesunion.com/business/first-niagara-repays-federal-bailou…
There is a local example.
Well I believe YES, they have
Well I believe YES, they have worked for the rich to get richer and NO, for the people, they were intended to work for. So, it depends on which side of the fence you are on.
BEA, FOX news is right wing
BEA, FOX news is right wing and CNN is left wing. So, instead of getting our political answer from them. Do some fact finding. I can't truly say that FOX is out to destroy Obama because, he has been doing that himself.
If Fox news is about
If Fox news is about destroying Obama,Then what was MSNBC about destroying Bush...MSNBC is the most one side News network i've seen..That's all they do is trash the GOP..What happened to all the outrage directed at Bush about bringing the troops home..Obama has added more troops in Afganistan..Whats the differance..Were's all the outrage..i though we were going to bring all the troops home..When is the date we are leaving Afganistan...All they did was hammer Bush for a date to pull out of Iraq...I though we were closing Gitmo...Still no plan..just like his Stimulus plan..All BS...Like Peter said,Obama said if we did this Stimulus plan right away,don't read it just vote on it ,it would keep unemployment at 8%,talk about being had..At least with the Banks we see results..
The News doesn't always tell
The News doesn't always tell the truth does it?I know Obama would like to do things like close Guantanamo.End the war.But he can not they will not let him will they?
Who is this "they" that won't
Who is this "they" that won't let him? It's really easy to make promises to just about anything, until you actually have to be held accountable for them.
Where is the President supposed to send all these detainees currently being held? They are very bad people, most were taken on the field of battle, and no country wants them, including the countries they originate from. Also, many of the ones that were supposedly innocent and let go earlier went back to their hostile actions and have been re-captured. What should we do with them?